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sam
honestly...i think the method shows...unorthodox belief leading to unorthodox evangelistic methods...my opinion as a common man anyway.
ive nothing against Islam,or modern american evangelical brands of christianity...im a religious man myself,and had a muslim friend from croatia...he didnt hate jews or christians and we always had great conversations about religious traditions and values we shared,and application of spiritual principles and disciplines in daily life.
so..im not criticising you or your religion...only the evangelistic method that just seems to miss the whole point of religion...the mistake being that the point of religion is escape from hell...no...certainly there is an accountability to our maker that we all share,no one would dispute this..however...religion is not for a fire escape...that mentality has tainted religion and caused a lot of problems,and brouhgt much deserved criticism on my own as well.
the core of both of our religions is to love God with all your heart and to show it by loving your neighbor as yourself,treating said neighbor as youd treat God,as..that is the measure of how we treat God,...religion is to make a difference now,here,to make the world a better place...im not denying heaven or hell,just saying thats not the point...."perfect love cast out fear" was said on that topic 2,000 years ago,not based on judgement.
your religion holds Christ to be a prophet,and to be listened to...He spoke more of bringing in the kingdom of God as His goals here than about any other goal,...not just the future heaven.
of course my religion holds Christ to be more than a prophet as do i,but...thats no reason for us to kill each other or dislike each other,lol,becaause then we are both abandoning our religions.
peace be with you,
adam
I am happy for your participation and your readiness for discussion.
The Definition of Islam for A Christian
What does 'Islam' mean? Islam is not a new religion, but the same truth that God revealed through all His prophets to every people; Islam is both a religion and the complete way of life. Muslims follow a religion of peace, mercy, and forgiveness. The Arabic word 'Islam' simply means 'submission', and derives from a word meaning 'peace'. In a religious context it means complete submission to the will of God. 'Mohammadanism' is thus a misnomer because it suggests that Muslims worship Muhammad (peace be upon him) rather than God. 'Allah' is the Arabic name for God, which is used by Arab Muslims and Christians alike.
Islam is not Just for Arabs. The Truth of Islam is meant for all people regardless of race, nationality or linguistic background. Taking a look at the Muslim World, from Nigeria to Bosnia and from Malaysia to Afghanistan is enough to prove that Islam is a Universal message for all of mankind --- not to mention the fact that significant numbers of Europeans and Americans of all races and ethnic backgrounds are coming into Islam.
Muslims' Belief in Jesus
Muslims respect and revere Jesus (peace be upon him). They consider him one of the greatest of Gods messengers to mankind. The Qur'an confirms his virgin birth, and a chapter of the Qur'an is entitled Maryam (Mary). The Qur'an describes the birth of Jesus as follows:
{ (Remember) when the angels said, O Mary, God gives you good news of a word from Him (God), whose name is the Messiah Jesus, son of Mary, revered in this world and the Hereafter, and one of those brought near (to God). He will speak to the people from his cradle and as a man, and he is of the righteous. She said, My Lord, how can I have a child when no mortal has touched me? He said, So (it will be). God creates what He wills. If He decrees a thing, He says to it only, Be! and it is. } (Qur'an, 3:45-47)
Jesus was born miraculously by the command of God which had brought Adam into being without a father. God has said:
{ The case of Jesus with God is like the case of Adam. He created him from dust, and then He said to him, Be! and he came into being } (Qur'an, 3:59)
During his prophetic mission, Jesus performed many miracles. God tells us that Jesus said:
{ I have come to you with a sign from your Lord. I make for you the shape of a bird out of clay, I breathe into it, and it becomes a bird by Gods permission. I heal the blind from birth and the leper. And I bring the dead to life by Gods permission. And I tell you what you eat and what you store in your houses.... } (Qur'an, 3:49)
Muslims believe that Jesus was not crucified. It was the plan of Jesus enemies to crucify him, but God saved him and raised him up to Him. And the likeness of Jesus was put over another man. Jesus enemies took this man and crucified him, thinking that he was Jesus. God has said:
{ ...They said, We killed the Messiah Jesus, son of Mary, the messenger of God. They did not kill him, nor did they crucify him, but the likeness of him was put on another man (and they killed that man)... } (Qur'an, 4:157)
Neither Muhammad (Peace be upon him) nor Jesus (Peace be upon him) came to change the basic doctrine of the belief in one God, brought by earlier prophets, but rather to confirm and renew it.
www.jesuswillreturn.com
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Islam's Rational Appeal
Islam, with its clear and direct expression of truth, has a great appeal to anyone seeking knowledge. It has a solution for all problems that arise during the course of one's life. It is a guide toward a better and complete life.
I will soon be on the rest of discussion
in my own mind at least,one of the greatest ways to measure a man's religion is by how he talks to,treats those who differ from him,whether one is able to be kind to those one perceives to be in error,which seems to be similiar to loving ones enemies,though preferably one is not enemies with those one disagrees with,lol.
it has been my experience in my former years,that too often my zeal for my particular sect was stronger than my love for those of different sects those who differed from me,this has all too often been a weakness in the christian religion as well...too often we care more about being right,than we do about people,still...they still let me keep coming around,as i contribute towards the imperfection.
what about you?what about Islam? can you relate to that at all?
(and no prepackaged answers please),lol.
peace be with you,
adam
Surah 54. Al-Qamar (The Moon)
In the name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.
1. The Hour (of Judgment) is nigh, and the moon is cleft asunder.
2. But if they see a Sign, they turn away, and say, "This is (but) transient magic."
3. They reject (the warning) and follow their (own) lusts but every matter has its appointed time.
4. There have already come to them Recitals wherein there is (enough) to check (them),
5. Mature wisdom;- but (the preaching of) Warners profits them not.
6. Therefore, (O Prophet,) turn away from them. The Day that the Caller will call (them) to a terrible affair,
7. They will come forth,- their eyes humbled - from (their) graves, (torpid) like locusts scattered abroad,
8. Hastening, with eyes transfixed, towards the Caller!- "Hard is this Day!", the Unbelievers will say.
9. Before them the People of Noah rejected (their apostle): they rejected Our servant, and said, "Here is one possessed!", and he was driven out.
10. Then he called on his Lord: "I am one overcome: do Thou then help (me)!"
11. So We opened the gates of heaven, with water pouring forth.
12. And We caused the earth to gush forth with springs, so the waters met (and rose) to the extent decreed.
13. But We bore him on an (Ark) made of broad planks and caulked with palm- fibre:
14. She floats under our eyes (and care): a recompense to one who had been rejected (with scorn)!
15. And We have left this as a Sign (for all time): then is there any that will receive admonition?
16. But how (terrible) was My Penalty and My Warning?
17. And We have indeed made the Qur'an easy to understand and remember: then is there any that will receive admonition?
18. The 'Ad (people) (too) rejected (Truth): then how terrible was My Penalty and My Warning?
19. For We sent against them a furious wind, on a Day of violent Disaster,
20. Plucking out men as if they were roots of palm-trees torn up (from the ground).
21. Yea, how (terrible) was My Penalty and My Warning!
22. But We have indeed made the Qur'an easy to understand and remember: then is there any that will receive admonition?
23. The Thamud (also) rejected (their) Warners.
24. For they said: "What! a man! a Solitary one from among ourselves! shall we follow such a one? Truly should we then be straying in mind, and mad!
25. "Is it that the Message is sent to him, of all people amongst us? Nay, he is a liar, an insolent one!"
26. Ah! they will know on the morrow, which is the liar, the insolent one!
27. For We will send the she-camel by way of trial for them. So watch them, (O Salih), and possess thyself in patience!
28. And tell them that the water is to be divided between them: Each one's right to drink being brought forward (by suitable turns).
29. But they called to their companion, and he took a sword in hand, and hamstrung (her).
30. Ah! how (terrible) was My Penalty and My Warning!
31. For We sent against them a single Mighty Blast, and they became like the dry stubble used by one who pens cattle.
32. And We have indeed made the Qur'an easy to understand and remember: then is there any that will receive admonition?
33. The people of Lut rejected (his) warning.
34. We sent against them a violent Tornado with showers of stones, (which destroyed them), except Lut's household: them We delivered by early Dawn,-
35. As a Grace from Us: thus do We reward those who give thanks.
36. And (Lut) did warn them of Our Punishment, but they disputed about the Warning.
37. And they even sought to snatch away his guests from him, but We blinded their eyes. (They heard
"Now taste ye My Wrath and My Warning."
38. Early on the morrow an abiding Punishment seized them:
39. "So taste ye My Wrath and My Warning."
40. And We have indeed made the Qur'an easy to understand and remember: then is there any that will receive admonition?
41. To the People of Pharaoh, too, aforetime, came Warners (from Allah..
42. The (people) rejected all Our Signs; but We seized them with such Penalty (as comes) from One Exalted in Power, able to carry out His Will.
43. Are your Unbelievers, (O Quraish), better than they? Or have ye an immunity in the Sacred Books?
44. Or do they say: "We acting together can defend ourselves"?
45. Soon will their multitude be put to flight, and they will show their backs.
46. Nay, the Hour (of Judgment) is the time promised them (for their full recompense): And that Hour will be most grievous and most bitter.
47. Truly those in sin are the ones straying in mind, and mad.
48. The Day they will be dragged through the Fire on their faces, (they will hear "Taste ye the touch of Hell!"
49. Verily, all things have We created in proportion and measure.
50. And Our Command is but a single (Act),- like the twinkling of an eye.
51. And (oft) in the past, have We destroyed gangs like unto you: then is there any that will receive admonition?
52. All that they do is noted in (their) Books (of Deeds):
53. Every matter, small and great, is on record.
54. As to the Righteous, they will be in the midst of Gardens and Rivers,
55. In an Assembly of Truth, in the Presence of a Sovereign Omnipotent.
Surah 54. Al-Qamar (The Moon) SOUND OPEN LINK
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=scQRFXJO_gE
Adam, I agree with you about religions and their "need to be right" - oftentimes only creating more confusion in an already confused mind...simply because they need to try and prove a point. However, I already talked about this in another thread (Gospel let's talk about something Godly), so I won't repeat myself and bore everyone to tears. lol
As far as enemies are concerned Adam, this is something many have difficulty with, and struggle with, because they're missing a key element in the equation. (-: The key is to see everyone as ourselves, and rather than focus on what we see as error in someone, go beyond error to the truth within each and every one of us. When you are able to do this, and go beyond what "appears" to be true, you no longer see error in others, thus healing the separation, and all that appears to be true....but really isn't (-: In truth there is no separation, and we are all one, created by one God (no matter what you choose to call Him). This is accomplished by reawakening spiritual vision, or as it's known in religious terms.....Christ vision. Our physical eyes and ears deceive us, but "true vision" goes beyond what appears to be, to the truth within. It's been said somewhere (maybe the Bible), "In order to know God again, you must first know your brothers." This is what that statement meant, and how we come about its accomplishment. Once we see and know our brothers as ourselves, and see no separation, then we will know God and all creation....because then we will "experience" God's creation. We won't find this by bickering and fighting over who's right and who's wrong, but rather by opening ourselves up to the experience that IS God. I won't lie to you Adam, it takes some effort and willingness to achieve, but the rewards are beyond anything you could ever imagine! The Bible says, "Many are called, but few are chosen." When properly understood, EVERYONE is called, but few choose to listen. (-: The ability to see truly is within each and every one of us, because in God's Domain, the exception to the rule is that there ARE no exceptions to the rule! He's an equal opportunity Creator. (-:
Ok...I'm done now! lol I get carried away on these topics far to easily, and could go on forever! lol Thanks for the opportunity to share and express my viewpoints and experience. Anything you'd like to add...please feel free. Have a great day!
