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"Congratulate Wal-Mart.

Low prices attract American consumers and provide jobs for Americans.

Non-union jobs paying $10.00 an hour EMPLOY 2X AS MANY PEOPLE as union jobs paying $20.00 per hour.

** Why would YOU want to pay higher prices to protect some union person's higher wages?

** Why would you want 1 person unemployed so 1 other person can make 2x as much money?

All of you pro-union folks think about these questions."

First off, Wal-Mart employees are not starting out $10.00 an hour, they start at minimun wage with benefits after 90 days.

I worked at Target for about a year and started out at $7.25 an hour without benefits. After 90 days they offered me benefits in which I had to pay into. I obviously declined because of the cost of living. After a year of not missing work they offered me a 10 cent raise. They do this expecting the worker to quit (which I did). The cycle begins, they hire someone else, no benefits at a low wage and the game continues. (BTW, Wal-mart offers a lower wage and benefits to its employees)

This is what TCK deleted however I didn't deserve it. Don't hide behind the delete button please.

BTW, I won't be deleting any of your post.

Wait a minute Josh. You are saying that tck delete one of your posts to promote his own personal agenda? Sounds like a Washington type deal. Hey, I always thought he'd make a good politician. Wait, he's the mayor of Lesbian Falls, Ohio. Ok making sense now.

Haha. Na Tck is a good guy I'm just merely making my voice heard. Especially if I'm being appropriate and relevant. TCK must be pushing his socialist post agenda.

tck is a missinformer who seems to take great joy in either spreading miss information

or coming up excuses for things to not change,i think he's ron paul,or rue paul

not sure which

He has some good points. Unions go over board. He never mentions companies go overboard too. That is just not possible.

I found it puzzling that though minimum wage increases inflation and is considerably higher than wages over seas placing unreasonable burdens on business and ensuring jobs continue to leave...tck still supports minimum wage. I asked him to explain this.

Anti union but not anti minimum. "No one deserves a living wage" his words.

I chose the logical pro business stance. One that recognizes the value of outsourcing. One that recognizes that money has no borders, no loyalties but to business. That over seas relocation is good for stock holders. So why would or should any company employ americans when they can get cheap labor, no taxes, lax safety and environmental laws and make more money?

Every job lost here represents money and productivity leaving this country. Tax dollars and consumer dollars. Less consumerism and domestic business feels the crunch. We have lost over 2.5 million jobs since 2000, and growing. However our countries welfare is not part of a successful global business model. We have nothing to take advantage here compared to what other locations can offer. India and china have 3 billion potential consumers and rising with 50 years of growth ahead of them. We have 250 million and stagnant. We have reached the end of our usefulness in the global business model. How can we even rate? Walmart IS the future. They set the president.

Tck did not seem to want to address my points concerning these cold hard facts because according to him unions are the problem. The reason jobs left.

I'm not about "winning" a discussion. I am about wanting people to fully explain their positions and trying to make sense of it all.

I have shown in logical summation why what is good for business is not necessarily good for a country. Why in a global business model a country's welfare is not what is important, only what it can offer. and that the US does not fit that model.

And still some ignore the reality of it.

To me, just like anti trust laws, when a business gets to a certain size what it does to the economy BECOMES in the national interest. Eminent domain. For the bullshit I go through as a small business owner I would give my left not to get some of the breaks these companies are getting. I pay my own insurance, social security, sales/room tax 10%

and property taxes. As a business owner my phone and internet are higher not by use but simply by designation. My mortgage rate is higher with short arms. We're stuck in a commercial loan. We have paid over million in payments in 25 years. It's ****ing staggering.

Twice,

Wow, that is really interesting. We simply don't make anything anymore. It's all wall-street and big business and none have done anything good for the country as of late. You'd think after all those years of big breaks from the Bush administration we'd be in better shape but that idealogy has been proven wrong. I have a feeling if we didn't outsource we would have been more recession proof and been better off. Keep jobs here and allow people to live the American dream.

THATS what America WAS. Now, I don't know what the American dream is anymore. Small business struggles as big business gets the bail outs. It's a sad state we live in. I think TCK has forgotten that this countries middle class is the saving grace of the economy. Notice the %10 unemployment rates, yet he's complaining "we should do something about that". When you support companies such as Wal-Mart, you support product outsourcing (things made elsewhere) and the Americans employed by such a company have no hope of a decent living wage let alone saving money to go back to school or whatever it takes to get to their dream. It's a shame and the country and it's citizens don't benefit at all in the long run.

Trade in stocks. It's the only leveler. You can't depend on a decent retirement any other way. At least your in control. Company retirement plans are a joke. Since the break up of MA Bell it has been proven companies retirement commitments can be revoked at will. Again, money crosses all boarders. Money talks, hard work walks. Experience is a liability. A slave can work their fingers to the bone and their still eating gruel at the end of the day.

To the point, What will actually bring jobs back home short of US financial ruin so people will work for gruel or making outsourcing only legal under certain criteria and when the safe quota of outsourcing has been reached ( according to national interests)

then the rest are shit out of luck until we take care of our own first.

What do you think?

Ideas?

Well for one, the market has gone back up but I don't think in a good way. None of the regulations proposed by Obama have gone through. Seems like back to bad business to me and now we're setting ourselves up for the same thing to happen. I think it starts with regulations, at least regulations that prevent corruption. Somehow, we need to encourage (by law lol) to keep jobs HERE. This can't continue, the stock game is just that, a game. This has become our only reliance and at some point we will be in a hole that we can't climb out. I think energy is where it starts. Products, companies whatever it takes to get this country on a self sufficient path to success. To me, this is the future, however it's just a politcal game as of now... That's too bad too.

The problem with the market's recent rallying is that all the profit margins being presented by these companies were created by laying people off.... What are they going to do to make next quarter look good? lay more people off? Investors are now getting wise to this and are realizing that those profits cannot sustain when they are being created in this way. Its just another bubble to fill the void left by the last one..... when too many people are unemployed and living in "starvation mode" to keep sales up, that bubble is bound to burst. I say, instead of blowing bubbles why not try solving the problems?

Well, I'm in the Trucking and International Freight Business. I was a Teamster Union Boss for many years and my Dad was in the Union as well. Unions at one time had a good purpose, it was to protect the workers wages and rights. Not any longer my friends at least not with the teamsters. I am now with a large non union company that pays its employees excellent wages and benefits, without the union dues or hassles. Recently one large national Teamster Union trucking company had all of there drivers take a 15 % paycut nationaly and guess what. The "BOYS UPSTAIRS" didn't and are all scheduled to get their annual union bonuses, while the workers get a pay cut and no bonus just in time for the Holidays. Now isn't that special.

Good point Jump, something I've been saying for years but didn't have the personal experience to back it up like you have.

unions seem to be extortion rings who legally exist simply because they pay taxes.